Going to try....Coopers

[RothesayBrew]

OK, well first off, I'm pretty new to home brewing and still in the newbie experimental phase. So far I've done 1 Festa Blonde Lager, just bottled a Festa Red Ale and my second Festa Blonde is going into the carboy tonight. With the giant price increases in ready made wort kits locally (Festa and Brew House) I was looking at other options and also a platform for experiments. Maybe some day moving to nicer extract kits or BIAB.

Now Coopers seems to get a bad rap (I've been given the impressions it's for cheap alcoholics ). But some people seem to love the stuff (especially in the UK). I've got to try it out for myself but don't want to just buy the can. I was thinking as a first trial run I would get a Coopers Can kit ($20 one) and Muntons brewer enhancer (available locally).

Any opinions on which kit I should do? I tend to lean towards the less bitter lagers and ales.

[GAM]

Everwood sells bulk LME, hops and grain.

Sandy

[jason.loxton]

You'll find that if you add LME, rather than regular sugar (which you should), you'll be in the same price range on the Cooper's as just doing an extract kit from Everwood/Noble Grape or using Festabrew. Even if you end up paying a little more for your kit, though, if you cost it out per bottle, rather than per batch, you'll be talking pennies a drink. If, when you're about to drink a mediocre beer, you had the option to up grade for a nickel or a dime to a better bottle, wouldn't you take it at the time? (I use the same argument for craft beers: it is about a quarter a bottle to upgrade from swill to swell.)

[Tony L]

upgrade from swill to swell.)

Well that is one memorable quote that I will have to remember

You do what you want, but I will venture a guess that you will be surprised to find the full wort kits to be a hell of a lot better for the prices you pay than the K&K kits. The sugar do have a place in some brews but not in those canned kits which are more sugar than malt anyway.

[gm-]

Be ready to be disappointed, these kits taste like cider mixed with bud light.

[Ladd]

Give it a try, you never know you may like it. I brewed the cans of Coopers Lager for many years when I was younger and loved it (this was long before discovering craft beer though...). I would recommend if you try it, at bare minimum upgrading from the gold packet of Coopers yeast that comes with it to at least a packet of US-05 that has been properly re-hydrated. If you give it a go, let us know how it turns out!

[RothesayBrew]

Everwood sells bulk LME, hops and grain.

Sandy

And 1 gallon extract kits! Going to try those soon. It's just the shipping for the small stuff that kills me. Minimum $13 shipping on anything to Saint John area it seems. The Everwood site is awesome though, easy to navigate and clean looking. I highly recommend it solely based on its design. haven't ordered any products yet. I will in the future.

[RothesayBrew]

You'll find that if you add LME, rather than regular sugar (which you should), you'll be in the same price range on the Cooper's as just doing an extract kit from Everwood/Noble Grape or using Festabrew. Even if you end up paying a little more for your kit, though, if you cost it out per bottle, rather than per batch, you'll be talking pennies a drink. If, when you're about to drink a mediocre beer, you had the option to up grade for a nickel or a dime to a better bottle, wouldn't you take it at the time? (I use the same argument for craft beers: it is about a quarter a bottle to upgrade from swill to swell.)

Hmm haven't really done the math yet but what I figured was:
$45 for Festa

$18 Coopers Can
$6-8 Muntons Brew Enhancer (or $5-$10 for LME)

Total: $23-$28?

I do admit to being cheap, but I do appreciate a quality beer. Not that I have a very developed taste, but I certianly don't like off tastes, watery or cidery beer.

[RothesayBrew]

Give it a try, you never know you may like it. I brewed the cans of Coopers Lager for many years when I was younger and loved it (this was long before discovering craft beer though...). I would recommend if you try it, at bare minimum upgrading from the gold packet of Coopers yeast that comes with it to at least a packet of US-05 that has been properly re-hydrated. If you give it a go, let us know how it turns out!

I'm on the fence but I like your attitude. I guess I just need to know for myself that it's bad. If that makes sense.

Too bad there isn't a $5, 1 or 2 gallon Coopers. Then people like me could find out it sucks easier.

[McGruff]

I used to buy LME in 5 gallon pails made by my local United Canada Malting co. Way better than any kit beer.

[voltage]

A little bit of a side note but when substituting Light Malt Extract for Corn Sugar is it a 1:1 Ratio? I am experimenting with Mangrove Jacks (To make cheaper but still drinkable beer) with LME in place of Corn Sugar and I put a 1.3 KG LME in instead of the suggested 1 KG of Corn Sugar. I am guessing it really depends on the particular Malts themselves and is not a cut and dry conversion?

At least from my experience the "cheaper" kits come with some Malt Extract, some hopefully not too old yeast, and the instructions to add sugar. Makes sense to me... you're getting about $20 worth of Malt and Yeast so you just add water and low cost 1 KG or so of sugar to turn it into cheap beer.

[spears104]

You can substitute malt extract directly for dextrose with the can kits. You'd probably want to use a larger pack of yeast if you do. I think I used to add 1 kg of LME and .5 kg dextrose to get the beer over 4% ABV, which most of the can kits come to when brewed to the instructions.

Its not that the can kits are bad, but they are underwhelming compared to Festabrews or steeping grain/extract kits you can get now.

[RothesayBrew]

I'm taking the leap. I will try to update in 4-5 weeks when the first tasting takes place. Going to to try one of the recipes form the Coopers website, as long as I can source the ingredients locally (lme, DME, etc.)

[CartoonCod]

For those of you who want to add LME or DME to the kits, a thing to watch out for is how fermentable it is. From what I understand the kits were designed to add 1 kg of sugar to them and finish at a reasonable gravity. Since LME and DME have a lower percentage of fermentable sugars then corn or table sugar, adding them might cause the beer to finish with a higher gravity. Might still taste fine though. I think the key to getting good results with these kits is having good yeast and proper fermentation temps, and ingredients second.

[enduir]

Coopers will make you a drinkable beer, not amazing but not appalling (may not be as palatable to everyone). Subbing in some LME will likely improve the flavour. Won't be as good as a Festa I don't think and far below an all-grain. Mountmellick was always my favourite after several years of tin brewing. Extract/grain combo kits I haven't done enough to give a solid comparison, but I'd say maybe better than Festa.

That said, I still brew from tins when I need something cheap and cheerful or am pressed for time. I always keep a light lager in stock for a few Coors-Lite-fan friends. I've made some damn nice (and some damn ropey) lagers and pale ales but never could bring myself to put the effort into an all-grain batch to make a very light-tasting beer.

I'm in the middle of a deck and yard overhaul so not much time to brew, but I got 2 kits going in around an hour the other night while it was raining. I have a nice oatmeal stout and an IPA to make whenever I get some free time, kit beers will keep me going til then.

For me when it comes to price, whether it's a tin of Coopers, Festa or all-grain you'll still probably save $100+ per batch. Sure you couldn't beat that.

[FishHuntBrew]

Have messed around with those kits quite a bit, with the right steeping grains and yeast you can make a very decent beer out of them. For me the Achilles heel of those kits is the yeast, for me I can taste quite an off flavor that just gets worse with time. If you looking for a cheap way to do one, try the Coopers Canadian Blonde, with 1lb dme/lme, and 1lb any sugar of your choice, if you can get your hands on some steeping grains, say 500g of crystal 10 and 500g of vienna to freshen things up a bit and some US-05 or Notingham. It will turn out to be a very drinkable beer, as well if you can get your hands on a 1/2oz of a low AA hop, it would be worth throwing that in as well to freshen up the hop aroma.

[mcgster]

When i started out i found the Coopers kits a step down in quality from FestaBrew. I found the FestaBrew drinkable, and the coopers i could stomach, but thats the most i can say about it.

When i picked up my first extract + grain kit it was like stepping into a new world of brewing. The taste improvement was huge and it was basically the same price.

I had picked up some Coopers cans from BMV locally and they were all quite old. Coopers + some steeped grains might make a good beer. Before i switched to all grain i would do muntons LME and 1 lbs of grain and the beer was pretty good.

[RothesayBrew]

Success! I made a drinkable beer on par with the big brewers. Not craft quality or anything but drinkable and enjoyable. My recipe ended up being 1 kg Muntons Brewing Enhancer, 300 g Dextrose (yes I know, way too much, simple calculations gone bad) and the Coopers can. My tastes will eventually get more refined but for someone who's drink of choice is mainly Rickards, my results were quite good. Next to brew is a Thomas Cooper's Selection IPA, dry hopped with Cascade. Haven't figured out exactly how I will dry hop. Can't be that hard.

[spears104]

Good news! When I was learning to brew, I started off by improving can kits too! The Coopers IPA kits is pretty good if you modify it. It has bitterness, but like most cans and Festa/Brewhouse kits, it lets you down with the hop flavour and aroma. Dry hopping will really help wake it up.

Dry hopping is easy. Rack your beer into a secondary, and drop an oz or two of hop pellets in. Let it sit 3-4 days and then bottle/keg. First I rack into a bottling bucket. When bottleing or kegging, I use a SS pot scrubber on the end of my auto siphon as a hop filter. just boil it in some water first to sanitize. Others may have some good advice on this as well.

Cheers!

[McGruff]

The problem with these Cooper kits is freshness. My lhbs had a complete line of those kits and they were mostly out of BB date. You want fresh malt extract, especially the liquid. I did brew a Coopers Bitter last winter that was 2 days past the BB. I brewed it exactly the way they said to and it tasted like tin flavoured molasses. I should of just asked for 8 lbs. of light extract and go from there.

[enduir]

I still do the odd tin to keep inventory up when I'm short on brewing time (or enthusiasm) and I still think they make decent grog (I prefer Mountmellick over Coopers but maybe that's just because of the styles available). There's a stark difference between the tins and extract/grain kits. I also tried the Coopers IPA, enjoyed the result but it was miles short of any grain IPA I've done. Yours will likely end up better due to the dry-hop, I was in a rush to fill some kegs for an upcoming family get-together.

[RothesayBrew]

Thanks for the feedback. All Grain or even extract WILL be a step up, but at this point in my life (kids, job, home renovations = no time) Coopers and Festa will do just fine. Not cork (cap?) sniffing quality but on par or better than the store bought swill.

[revolutionarybrewer]

Rothesay: I have been brewing canned kits for quite a while (7 years) and I find it can make a pretty darn good beer. Keep the fermentation temps cool, try subbing out the yeast for a fresh 11g packet (if possible) and adding some hops are all options to improve on the quality. I have to admit I find brewing with fresh extract, hops and specialty grains generally make a bit better quality beer BUT if done right the canned kits can make a very tasty brew. Cheers.

[sleepyjamie]

In radical brewing book the author highly recommends after you buy a canned kit to throw it in the garbage

[revolutionarybrewer]

In radical brewing book the author highly recommends after you buy a canned kit to throw it in the garbage

Everyone has their own opinion but the reality is millions of people around the world brew canned kits and are happy with the beer they are making. I have produced hundreds of gallons of beer both my friends and I have enjoyed over the years with these kits. Also several 'experts and authors' have produced good beer with canned kits and were happy with the quality.

Im sure some beer snobs frown upon canned kit brewers and consider the kits worthy of the 'garbage'. The reality is though millions of regular beer drinkers are making easy and affordable beer that they really enjoy drinking. Nothing wrong with that in my books.