Sanitation

[GuingesRock]

Brewers vary in their attention to sanitation, even commercial brewers, and I think it reflects in their beer.

It is said that major infections are no problem, you know when they occur and you can usually sort them out, it’s the minor infections that you don’t know you have that detract from your beer, and are difficult to detect. Lack of maltyness, metallic taste would be a couple of examples of effects of minor infections.

I knew brewers in the past who proudly informed me they had never had an infection in their beer, their sanitation techniques scared the living daylights out of me, and their beer tasted, not so good.

Heat is often the only reliable way to sanitise. It gets through dirt and in the crannies of ball valves etc. A plastic valve on a plastic bucket fermentor is a bad idea. Same goes for that fast ferment contraption IMO.

I’m looking for collective information/knowledge on these minor infections and what they can do to your beer, how you can detect them in a beer sample etc. I think this is the crux of good beer.

[Celiacbrew]

Hey mark where did you hear that information about mild infections?

[GuingesRock]

Hey mark where did you hear that information about mild infections?

I was having another read of "Principals of Brewing Science" by George Fix.

Introduction page X111 if you have the book.

[Celiacbrew]

Hey mark where did you hear that information about mild infections?

I was having another read of "Principals of Brewing Science" by George Fix.

Introduction page X111 if you have the book.

I do. I put it down to pick up mastering Homebrew. Thanks Mark.

[McGruff]

I think cleaning your equipment before you sanitize it is important. I clean after every brew day, but sometimes I am in a hurry, or just don't do that good of a job. Now I clean everything before hand and hope it will cut down on off flavours in my beer.

[GuingesRock]

Now I clean everything before hand and hope it will cut down on off flavours in my beer.

Does anyone know what kind of off flavours you can get from this?

[Jimmy]

Does heat really sanitise all those nooks and crannies in a ball lock? If so, why do professional breweries, dairies, etc use sanitary triclover valves?

What about sanitising kegs? And how much does sanitation matter before kegging/bottling if you're not using heat for sanitation of your bottles and kegs?

[GuingesRock]

Jimmy, I think it depends how much heat and for how long. In my case I feel safe because I have my ball valves as close to the kettle as possible and they are at close to 100c for 90 minutes during the boil. Regarding kegs ...I worry. I sleep at night by telling myself 1) I have cleaned them well, 2) I left sanitiser in them (for several days to several weeks) 3) by kegging time the beer is not such a good culture medium as all the sugars have been fermented out and there is alcohol present which is antimicrobial. Fresh wort is different, it's at prime temperature and has lots of sugar and nutrients for growing stuff.

[CorneliusAlphonse]

i dont use anything plastic if i can help it, i replace tubing frequently, i clean everything well by soaking in oxyclean or PBW for long periods of time, i sanitize everything post-boil with starsan, i dont leave things in the basement anymore especially if they are damp. make sure everything dries thoroughly and quickly. also reduce steps where things can be exposed to anything outside of the sanitized fermentation environment (few to no transfers, dont open fermenters, keg under co2 if i weren't lazy)

[Jimmy]

I boil and ferment in the same vessel, but I still disassemble, scrub the vessel down after every brew, soak all valves/pieces in PBW and then Starsan. I re-assemble on brew day just before brewing.

My beer is in a closed environment until keg day (or dry hop day), and I transfer under pressure with c02. I boil my triclover barb and silicone hose that I use for transferring to kegs, just before transferring.

I've switched from using triclover ball valves to triclover butterfly valves. They are easier to clean, and don't have the hiding spots that ball valves have. There's nothing wrong with ball valves, plenty of people use them with success, but I prefer the butterfly.

[Mac]

I boil and ferment in the same vessel, but I still disassemble, scrub the vessel down after every brew, soak all valves/pieces in PBW and then Starsan. I re-assemble on brew day just before brewing.

My beer is in a closed environment until keg day (or dry hop day), and I transfer under pressure with c02. I boil my triclover barb and silicone hose that I use for transferring to kegs, just before transferring.

I've switched from using triclover ball valves to triclover butterfly valves. They are easier to clean, and don't have the hiding spots that ball valves have. There's nothing wrong with ball valves, plenty of people use them with success, but I prefer the butterfly.

What do you use that you can boil and ferment in?

[mumblecrunch]

I boil and ferment in the same vessel

What do you use that you can boil and ferment in?

You have some reading to do

[Mac]

I boil and ferment in the same vessel

What do you use that you can boil and ferment in?

You have some reading to do

ahh, I see. I've only just started brewing and haven't bothered to read about electric heating, or higher end equipment.

thanks

[mumblecrunch]

ahh, I see. I've only just started brewing and haven't bothered to read about electric heating, or higher end equipment.

thanks

Jimmy's is definitely Cadillac kit. Mark (GuingesRock) also ferments in his boil kettle, but it's something he put together from various pieces himself rather than a purchased all-in-one solution.

Lots of electric brewers in here, and more all the time. More than a few stovetop brewers too. There are folks doing 25 gallon batches on the regular and others who stick to 2-3 gallons. Chances are you'll find someone doing something like what you're looking to do; lots to learn, but lots of people to learn from, too.

[Celiacbrew]

So I think I found a weakness in my cleaning and sanitizing scheme. Usually I do my carboys by soaking them in hot PBW and then I let it sit for a couple days. Rinse it out and give it a quick sanitize by squirting a bunch of starsan in. Then I repeat the sanitize on brewday. Because of an infection problem I decided to step things up today. Took my clean carboy and added some really concentrated PBW and shook it up followed by a full volume soak in starsan. Looks like there was still crud left behind after a PBW soak, spritz with starsan and a shaking/swirling with concentrated PBW. Hopefully this is the source of my problems.

[GuingesRock]

I don't believe in spraying starsan. I think it's too easy to miss a small patch.