Gluten Free Beer

[GuingesRock]

Does anyone know what enzyme they are using?

http://www.thekitchn.com/the-making-of- ... ons-174200

[mr x]

Somebody is selling that stuff, maybe white labs.

Edit: One of these?

http://www.whitelabs.com/faq/enzymes" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[mikeorr]

This article says it's Brewer's Clarex. They don't really go into a ton of detail, however.

On a related note, my girlfriend is a Celiac and earlier this year on a road trip to the US she found some Omission - and absolutely loved it. No "glutening" or negative effects after drinking it either.

Michael.

[adams81]

I'm not super familiar with gluten free brewing but I thought that amylase was used in the process.

[CartoonCod]

Check out the description of Clarity-Ferm, it says it can reduce the gluten concentration to below 20 ppm.
http://www.whitelabs.com/other-products ... arity-ferm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[GuingesRock]

Awesome (and quick) responses. Thanks.

Might help also with GI upsets and other hangover symptoms the day after drinking. Especially since varying degrees of gluten sensitivity are quite common.

My wife asked me to look into it. She has quite a bit of trouble with gluten, but hasn't been tested. There's a blood test now for celiac (TTG) that GP's can order. Since that blood test became available, many more people have been diagnosed with gluten sensitivity, and it's much more common than was previously thought to be the case. Other's seem to have symptoms from gluten with normal TTG test.

It's sometimes a dose dependant thing and I found something Ben wrote, in another gluten discussion, quite interesting:

I've tried to minimize my gluten intake. A night with a half-dozen beer, a few slices of pizza (even healthy thin-crust like Morris East), and a bit of gluten spread out through the day makes me feel awful the next morning. I find if everything else in my diet is basically Paleo then I can have a bunch of beer and feel okay. It's definitely tough to find restaurant menu items that aren't full of gluten though. It's all burgers and wraps with a side of fries/rice. Carbs, carbs, carbs.

[GuingesRock]

I got a very nice pm today from a new member on here who has a passion for craft beer but is yet to brew his first beer. He wants to come and do a brew with me and share the costs of ingredients, and be able to take home some beer he’s made. I’m excited about it!

But! Here’s the thing! He wants to make gluten free beer for his girlfriend who is a celiac and he wants to pay to have the finished product tested for gluten content to make sure it is safe for her to drink. It could be a very interesting project, but we’re going to need help I think, as well as leads for more research.

I really think it has to be made from malted Barley, so it tastes like real beer. My wife was reading a link about how people with gluten sensitivity can often tolerate beer made with barley as it is a different kind of gluten or something. Wheat beers are apparently very bad though. I’ve asked her to try to find the link again…but that’s a start.

I suppose I’ll need to find out what kind of beer she likes, and if it isn’t hoppy IPA or English bitter, I’ll need to ask for a good recipe, but for now it’s the gluten thing I really need help with.

We’ll be sure to keep you updated on progress and test results. If there is a picture of a happy girlfriend at the end, drinking a mug of tested and confirmed gluten free REAL beer with her proud boyfriend, then I will consider it a success, but there might be a lot of water under the bridge before that day comes. Maybe it’s easy…I don’t know.

Thanks in advance for any help.

[CartoonCod]

I've recently made two batches of GF beer, a hoppy citra pale ale, and a rhubbarb ale. Both turned out very nice compared to what you can buy in the LC (very beer like). I used a combination of sorghum extract, home malted millet, and corn sugar for the fermentables. Let me know if you want some details.

I've got a post on here where I talked about a home made millet malt experiment which may be of interest: http://www.brewnosers.org/forums/viewto ... lit=millet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Also this link may be worth checking out, it is from Jon Plise (brewing network): http://www.glutenfreecraftbeer.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
And for recipes here is another site: http://www.glutenfreehomebrewing.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Also from what I understand (and I am still learning this as well), gluten can have many different forms such as gliadin which is found in wheat (which is typically what the tests measure), and hordeine which is found in barely (I don't think there are tests to measure this protein, but don't take my word for it).

Let me know what you find out!

[GuingesRock]

Thanks VERY much. It might be that it’s the wheat that causes the problem with celiac disease and not the barley, but cross contamination can occur. Gluten sensitivity on the other hand might be barley. That’s if I read this Wiki page right: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gluten_sensitivity (I’m half awake and only 1 cup of tea and rushed).

It’s a good starting point for further reading.

But then again, maybe that’s not true: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coeliac_disease It’s giong to take more in depth reading of studies I think and I really need to wake up. Often with these things the studies have not been done.

If what CartoonCod says about testing is true, and the test only measures Gliadin (found in wheat) then beer made with barley will test –ve, unless it is cross contaminated. If the proteins in barley do cause problems for celiacs (needs to do more research on that) then we have a testing problem.

More questions…might it be possible that problem proteins are denatured during a long boil, and if so would a longer boil do the job. Which proteins do the enzymes that people posted links for above work on?, how effective are they? How to use them? Is there a blanket way to remove all protein from beer (eg. low micron filter, or Irish moss plus coarser filter) and if so how would that affect the beer?

[LiverDance]

I didn't go through it all but here is another thread with reference to research articles and discussions on GFB.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f164/clarit ... ty-354908/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[GuingesRock]

I didn't go through it all but here is another thread with reference to research articles and discussions on GFB.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f164/clarit ... ty-354908/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That looks perfect! Thanks! The more questions answered the more arise. I wonder if it isn't possible to simply remove all protein from the beer. Head retention isn't a big thing in my books and maybe there's a way around that too, maybe even replacing with another protein if it was really necessary.

[mr x]

Gum arabic.

[GuingesRock]

Gum arabic.

Thanks! Any ideas on how all proteins, especially potentially problematic ones, could be removed from the beer, before adding gum arabic? any problems foreseen in doing that?

[mr x]

You can add in the keg IIRC, after fermentation is done. I've never used it, so I don't know much more about using it, other than it takes very little to do the job.

[GuingesRock]

Thanks Mr X

I didn't go through it all but here is another thread with reference to research articles and discussions on GFB.

http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f164/clarit ... ty-354908/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I just had a chance to go through Brian's link, and its excellent. I also found another good one: http://www.examiner.com/article/gluten- ... c-impaired.

There are so many different types of reactions to many different cereal proteins, that vary in severity from minor to life threatening, that, if it were possible, removing all the proteins from the beer, might be the best and simplest option, apart from avoiding wheat and barley in the fermentables. I've never been heavily into grains and for me it's all about hops, so I don't care that much. I think it's a bit like the difference between a "leg man" and a "breast man" cf. "hop man/woman" and "malt man/woman".

If it isn't to be barley or wheat, what is it to be?

For a true celiac, purchasing some of those tests and randomly testing peoples beers might be an option, as many might pass the test.

I'm still really interested to see if there is a way to remove all the protein from a barley based beer.

[Rathers]

Hey,

Sorry I figured I would give my 2 cents on this. Most gluten free beers are made with millet/sorghum or buckwheat etc. These work because they are naturally gluten free. However most people are not the greatest fans of beer made with these cereals. Also if you can not get them malted then they do require mash enzymes which can be annoying.

The problem with making gluten free beer from barley or wheat is that there is always trace amounts of gluten left. All the methods of making gluten free beer with barley are just steps to reduce the final gluten content. The clarex works because its a filtering aid. Its actually mainly used to get rid of beta glucans and other things to make the beer easier to filter. The clarex is just coagulating (fining) some the gluten out and creating a less gluten filled beer. Its like trying to make alcohol free beer after you have made the an alcoholic beer. There will still be trace amounts of alcohol no matter what method you use to reduce the alcohol.

Good luck man!

[GuingesRock]

Thanks very much Andrew, especially for the non-gluten "malt" bill information, which is the other part I needed to know about, and also for the pointer back towards Clarex + filtering.

The Clarex plus filtering might get us through the gluten test.

Is this where we are at now...combining both methods in the quote below?

(from the link 2 posts above): Professor Michael Lewis, University of California at Davis, Extension Program convincingly argues in his paper, Celiac Disease, Beer and Brewing that the natural malting, mashing, boiling, fermenting, aging, filtering process can remove enough prolamin/polypeptide/gluten and may render it safe for many inflicted with Celiac disease.

If you don’t trust that the natural processing of malted barley into beer doesn’t reduce offending proteins enough, then there is another option that now promises to eliminate all offending prolamin/polypeptide/glutens from beverages. Brewers Clarex™ (Brewers Clarex™ citation 1; Brewers Clarex™ citation 2) is an enzyme developed by DSM Food Specialties specifically eliminating all traces of prolamin/polypeptide/gluten in beer, wine, alcohol and fruit juices when used appropriately.

Could also throw Irish moss in the boil, cold crash, and leave in the keezer for a couple of weeks before filtering. My Champagne Cascade might be a good recipe for this. The malt I used has a lower protein than usual. It would be beautifully clear, very pale coloured (almost same colour as Champagne) it could be extra carbonated, and would have no head, nice and crisp, very hoppy, and alcoholic, and delicious.

I put my Randall out on the back step and left it there because I was mad at it for leaking and spilling half a keg into the keezer. I can see now I’ll have to get it in, clean it, and get it ready for its new occupation as a filter. I wonder what size micron filter I should buy for it? I'll take the bazooka out so it will become a normal filter housing again....and either hook it up as a keg jumper, or between the keg and the Blichmann bottling gun.

Perhaps the Clarex wouldn't be needed if the filter was fine enough and everything else is rigorous enough.

[mr x]

The clarex works because its a filtering aid... The clarex is just coagulating (fining) some the gluten out and creating a less gluten filled beer.

Do you have a source for this info?

[mikeorr]

Interestingly enough, the US FDA just today released their final rule that defines what is "gluten-free": here.

It now explicitly allows Omission to label itself as "gluten-free" since the gluten gets removed/reduced, and the subsequent testing shows less than 20 ppm gluten.

[Rathers]

Mr X. You are right I got mixed up with another product. I attached a quick link to Probrewer about clarex. However I would still not use it if making a 100% gluten free beer and stick to buckwheat/sorghum but I think that's a personal choice.

http://discussions.probrewer.com/showth ... ers-Clarex" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[GuingesRock]

Thanks for the link. It looks a bit concerning...as I thought. I wonder if Irish moss, low protein malted barley, and low micron filtration would do it. I think I might give that a try. Does anyone know where to get the gluten testing kits?

[mr x]

Funny thread.

[GuingesRock]

Romer Labs Gluten test...Looks fiddly. http://www.romerlabs.com/en/products/glutengliadin/

I love the way they say it is "easy to use, fast and reliable"

Did anyone find a simpler test?

The AgraStrip® Gluten G12 Test Kit is an immunochromatographic test for the detection of gluten in foodstuffs. The test kit uses a new monoclonal antibody called G12 that specifically recognises the pathogenic fragment of the gliadin protein present in gluten. This fragment is called 33-mer and triggers the auto-immune reaction in coeliac patients. During the test, the sample reacts with a coloured conjugate (anti-gliadin 33mer monoclonal antibody – red-coloured microsphere) which forms a complex with the reagent on the strip. This complex spreads along the membrane by capillary action. The AgraStrip® Gluten G12 is easy to use, fast and reliable.

Here's another, I think similar, test with prices listed: http://glutenfreecooking.about.com/od/g ... estkit.htm and another http://glutenfreecooking.about.com/od/g ... ostics.htm

[GuingesRock]

From Here: http://byo.com/india-pale-ale/item/89-a ... -your-beer" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regarding filtering:

Filtering beer to reduce or eliminate chill haze can also strip out body, flavor, and head retention. Do not use a micron filter that is too fine. The heavier, more full-bodied beers can be affected most by filtering the beer.

Regarding enzymatic protein degradation during the malting process:

The majority of protein molecules in raw, unmalted grain are extremely large and must be broken down. This starts with the malting process, in which whole, unmalted barley is germinated to a certain degree and then dried to make malted barley. The most significant action that occurs is the development of enzymes that act directly to degrade or modify the complex chains of nitrogen-based proteins into smaller chains of amino acids correctly termed polypeptides, not proteins, and into single amino acids. Also, small amounts of dextrins and fermentable sugars are developed and some insoluble starch is made soluble.

Enzymes are perhaps the most important class of protein in the brewing process. At least eight enzymes in malt can break down or degrade proteins, but each plays a highly specific role.

Regarding enzyme use study here: http://www.mbaa.com/meetings/archive/20 ... s/129.aspx

ABSTRACT: Gluten sensitivity affects an estimated 6% of the general population, leaving many unable to drink beers fermented from conventional grains. Gluten sensitivity is caused by a T-cell driven intolerance to wheat gluten epitopes. Gluten epitopes are proline rich and are vulnerable to enzymatic degradation by prolyl oligopeptidases. Aspergillus niger prolyl endoprotease (AN-PEP) has been shown to efficiently degrade gluten by post-proline cleavage. Studies have also shown AN-PEP to be active at pH ranges from 2 to 8, with peak enzymatic activity at pH 5–5.5. Enzymatic degradation of gluten in pre-boil wort by AN-PEP may be achieved, producing gluten-free beers with conventional grains. Gluten degradation occurs by cooling the wort to 37°C as it is transferred from the mash tun to the kettle, and whirlpooling the 37°C wort with the AN-PEP enzyme until gluten degradation is complete. The wort is then boiled as normal, with the AN-PEP denaturing before fermentation occurs. The end result is gluten-free beer with the flavor profile of a conventional grain recipe.

My question is? Malting and mashing might degrade gluten, and that, in combination with Irish moss and a fine micron filter, might get the beer through the gluten test, and make it in compliance with the new FDA definition of “gluten Free” posted above by Michael, without the need for added genetically engineered enzymes that could themselves be potentially toxic.